What a wonderful heartwarming story. It is great to hear about a church helping people.

I could say that $5000 is probably a small part of their budget, but I won't. Any little bit helps - especially to those who are in great need.

There's a lot of church PR going on at the moment. I'm wondering if it's anything to do with decreasing numbers?

It makes you wonder how they justify this kind of thing with, "But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing" Matthew 6:3

It seems like they want everyone's left hand to know what they're doing. There's a reason the media found out about this and it wasn't by accident

The verse you mentioned does not have any correlation with the situation. They told people they could have some cash if they needed it. They weren't going around to the homeless and telling the media. I think the two are entirely different.

And I think it's a ridiculous assertion that they're doing this to get more numbers. If this were a company instead of a church, you'd be applauding them. Instead, because it's an institution that believes in God, you're finding any way you can criticize them. It can't possibly be true charity, can it?

And chances are that the media was alerted because one of the newpaper writers, editors, etc goes to the church.

I suspect that this church's giving-program was started genuinely and then the media got involved after it was seen to be a fantastic idea.

10/10 for a church putting out a good story for a change instead of hate and anger.

I could completely turn a blind eye to the fact that the church propogates some seriously weird* teachings if they did more of this sort of thing.



*AKA scientifically false and misleading.

Pray tell why not

Matthew6:3,4 (NKJV)

3 But when you do a charitable deed, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, 4 that your charitable deed may be in secret; and your Father who sees in secret will Himself reward you openly.

Seems quite simple to me. Jesus said that charity and good deeds should be done in secret.

What's your problem with Jesus' words?

You know this how? You're asserting something as fact which you have no basis for.

I don't think any good deeds or charity should be used as media tools whether it be church, individual or commercial organisation.

Just remember that churches are tax exempt, they make substantial amounts of cash.

I have no idea why you're so incredulous that in this time of credit crunch that a salary paid Pastor would want to ensure his church and therefore his source of income are protected.

I know if I was a pastor and my flock numbers were dwindling I'd be giving coupons for prayers and other incentive s**t.

I strongly suspect that if this was a company doing this you wouldn't be arguing with someone who said it was a PR stunt yet you suspend your reasoning and intelligence when it comes to a religious organisation.

Next you'll be arguing that the Vatican isn't a money making operation.

The point is that a pastors flock are his livelihood, his source of income. Why is it so unbelievable that he wouldn't use good management and PR tools to ensure his business thrives?

I blame the atheists. I'm not sure for what, but I am sure they are to blame.

Or Obama.

I hear they eat babies and worship science and s**t

Yeah, but it's an awesome church, with a big mural of Darwin with his finger touching an ape painted on the ceiling by Dan Brown

yes there is every bit of a chance that the church spent $5000 expecting to see a return on their investment of quite a but more than $5000.

There isn't anything wrong with that. That is how it works. That is where the $5000 came from in the first place.

If you needed money to purchase a dress for your daughter, to feed your grandmother, to keep the heat on would it matter to you if the money came from purely altruistic reasons or if came as part of a package to spur other donations?

My home church with an attendance of roughly 700 took in about $35,000 a week, which usually barely covered expenses.

This is not the first church around here to do this. However, it is the first one to actually make "news" past locals. Its never the church who tells, it is usually a parishioner that goes to the press with the story.

This actually happens a lot around here and has for quite a few years...before reports went out of the dwindling church numbers.

If $1,820,000/year "barely covers expenses" your church needs an audit and someone to take a hard look at what needs to be cut.

Wow, is it possible that no one will mention Robert Heinlen's ingenious novel on society and religion 'Stranger in a Strange Land'?

Is exactly what the Human/Martian Valentine Michael Smith did in the 'church' of sorts he founded. Not to give away the story too much, but the end result was that though a few people took a little bit, most gave more than they normally would, ending up with a huge net gain for the 'church'.

Of course the church from the article used slightly different methods, and I commend anyone who will help others that way, but still... my first thought was "I wonder where they got that idea..."


I would highly recommend the book to any and all, and I think I'll read it again. It is sitting on my bookshelf a few feet away. Great book.

They are. Which is exactly why only bad church stories make the news and good church stories don't.

And when I lend a neighbor a cup of sugar, it's because I want that neighbor to keep borrowing stuff..? Why can't it be that someone sees a need and just wants to help? All Christians have ulterior motives?, good grief. A person could just as easily decide not to attend that church because 'people are just helping themselves to my donation', thereby dropping attendance, so I don't see it from your point of view at all.

edit: I may not agree with you but didn't dv your comment.

They had a budget before the year started based on what they historically received, everything was already allocated.

Big buildings with lots of utilities get really expensive, about 10-15 employee salaries, and lots of mission spending.

I'm not saying that some of it didn't go into the nest egg for construction/bad times though.

Employees??? The only churches I've went to that anyone got paid was the pastor. Everything else was done by volunteers. Of course, I've only gone to small churches..so maybe thats why. 1church-19 members.. 2church-25members.. 3church-65 members. I haven't regularly attended a church in years though, since 96? I only visit two of the above churches when I so happen to be on that side of the state around the holidays.

I go to a big church in the States. They have paid staff. These people are considered "interns" and they work full time at the church and require compensation. The finances of my church are transparent and nicely laid out at budget meetings (open to all).

I'm sorry, what?

I've grokked it thoroughly.