Plime/1Eminent Domain - A womans fight to keep her property. : ATOM 0.3Eminent Domain - A womans fight to keep her property. : ATOM 0.3www.plime.complime@plime.com2009, www.plime.com.2009-12-01T21:57:55+01:00<![CDATA[Eminent Domain - A womans fight to keep her property.]]>556142008-03-25T07:07:11+01:002008-03-25T07:07:11+01:00
That's the slogan used by Avon Citizens for Change. The group has registered as a political action committee with the Lorain County Board of Elections and started a legal defense fund to help Mary Jane Wolfe in her fight to keep her property.]]>
<![CDATA[logic @ 4/15/2008 2:21:55 PM]]>2391172008-04-15T14:21:55+01:002008-04-15T14:21:55+01:00<![CDATA[avon7 @ 3/26/2008 9:31:28 AM]]>2261392008-03-26T09:31:28+01:002008-03-26T09:31:28+01:00 I said they were stealing her land because the price they offered is far LESS then current market value -- which the board members know because one of them is a land developer himself. If there was no other land available - people would understand. No one is disputing the need for a new middle school and an elementary school down to road.
And yes I am avonresident's friend. I am handling the website and an email was sent to me regarding this. While people are entitled to their opinions, the safest option is always to research something before you start slinging uneducated opinions.]]><![CDATA[avonresident @ 3/26/2008 7:13:11 AM]]>226110 We are very close to this issue and understand your points. Bottom line is that school does not need her property. The current middle school sits on 30 acres of land. We just put an addit...]]>2008-03-26T07:13:11+01:002008-03-26T07:13:11+01:00 We are very close to this issue and understand your points. Bottom line is that school does not need her property. The current middle school sits on 30 acres of land. We just put an addition on our high school to house the middle school students while the current school is demolished and the new one built. this was the school boards plan as of 1/06. The community passed the levy to make this happen. Now 2 years later they have decided that Mary Janes 30 acres is now the prefered option. Do you have any idea why a middle school needs 55 acres???? We have 2 new elementry schools and a new and improved high school.
None of this makes sense - there is a hidden agenda - eminent domain should be used as a last resort - not the first.
This is a very emotional issue and I respect your opinion. There is just so much more than just eminent domain going on here. Go to our website - it is filled with information. www.avoncitizensforchange.com]]><![CDATA[2manyusernames @ 3/25/2008 8:56:42 PM]]>225928«AvonResident : First of all - the group Avon Citizens for Change are organizing donations - not the family. This woman is ALONE! The school boa...]]>2008-03-25T20:56:42+01:002008-03-25T20:56:42+01:00«AvonResident : First of all - the group Avon Citizens for Change are organizing donations - not the family. This woman is ALONE! The school board has targeted this woman because she has been ill and figured she wouldn't put up much of a fight. Well they are wrong! There are thousands of acre's in this community that are undeveloped - and some are ACTUALLY for sale and meet the school boards needs. Eminent domain was never meant for this - it was to make room for roads and highways to build the infrastructure of towns and cities. Yes the community was behind the other land owners - why do you think the board backed down? I'll answer it for you - COMMUNITY OUTRAGE.
You have no idea what you are talking about - this property was purchased by her grandparents 60+ years ago and farmed as a family business. Just because you have land that was inherited does not make you inherently wealthy.
PS - thank God you are not my neighbor!Glad I'm not your neighbor? Yeah, that's really polite.
Eminent domain was not just for roads. You are wrong. Despite your statement, we are not misinformed and no one said they were a wealthy family. No one has said anything for you to be "offended" by.
You pretend that that such laws are only for roads. Would the family accept the $750,000 if it was for a road? By the way, not only is it not just for roads and highways, it isn't even confined to just real property. Eminent domain laws can also be called into play for just about anything if it is needed by the government. They can take personal property, even intangible property such as patents, copyrights, etc provided they can show a public need for the item.
Facts. Eminent Domain is a law. It is a law that has stood the test of hundreds and hundreds of years. It is for any government use, not just roads. It is not always pleasant but it is needed.
Obviously there is a special need for the property in question. If the other property was just as suitable they would purchase that. It would be cheaper and easier and less of a pr nightmare.
Unless you can show that the board is forcing the family to accept the buyout for personal reasons than there is no case to stand on. Not for this family and not for the millions of others affected.
Eminent Domain is rarely appreciated by those who are effected by it. That is sad, but nothing can be done. Common sense would show you that such laws are required. It would be downright impossible to provide needed infrastructure, schooling, utilities, and yes roads, etc without it.
Oh, and despite your friend, avon7's spin, the government is not "taking" the land, it is purchasing it. And as far as "setting a precedent" goes, the precedent was set sometime in the 16th century or so.
One more thing, it isn't just "this country" but many countries around the world that have eminent domain type laws.
I wonder if the problem lies in part because it is for a school. I know oftentimes families fight the building of a school as they don't want the increased number of families in the area. They want to prolong the development, keeping their "country life". This is of course an understandable desire, but it isn't one that can be granted universally.
Really obscene uses of eminent domain laws is where the government purchases someone's land that isn't producing much in the way of taxes and grants it to a developer that plans on building multiple homes, shopping center, or similar that will produce much greater taxes.
Yes, a case can be made that it is for the "general good". More revenue for the city, county, state, etc is for the common good, but it is a horrible twist on the concept of eminent domain. Some states passed laws forbidding that. As mentioned above, GW Bush signed an order preventing the federal government from using eminent domain laws for private benefits such as that.
That isn't the case here. It is for public use. It is for the benefit of the entire county/city.
Don't get me wrong. I sympathize with the family. As I said, it is tragic when it happens and the family doesn't want to sell for whatever reason. I can just see the inevitability and the need for it.]]><![CDATA[avon7 @ 3/25/2008 7:51:14 PM]]>2258512008-03-25T19:51:14+01:002008-03-25T19:51:14+01:00<![CDATA[TraumaMamma @ 3/25/2008 3:57:27 PM]]>225698«AvonResident : No - you did not offend me at all. Just some of the other comments from uninformed individuals. We appreciate any ...]]>2008-03-25T15:57:27+01:002008-03-25T15:57:27+01:00«AvonResident : No - you did not offend me at all. Just some of the other comments from uninformed individuals. We appreciate any and all postings which gets this story out there.
I do respect that everyone is entitled to their opinion. Just try to make it an informed one.I would love to talk with you more. I work for the county. Click on the envelope next to your name and send a msg to me....(Just as it is spelled)
I was so afraid after I linked this to your site, that you may see something that would upset you. It wasn't my intent. I wanted to get the story out there.
I grew up knowing that farm!!!]]><![CDATA[AvonResident @ 3/25/2008 3:50:52 PM]]>225691We appreciate any and all postings which gets this story out there.
I do respect that everyone is entitled to their opinion. Hopefully they will tr...]]>2008-03-25T15:50:52+01:002008-03-25T15:50:52+01:00We appreciate any and all postings which gets this story out there.
I do respect that everyone is entitled to their opinion. Hopefully they will try to make it an informed one.]]><![CDATA[TraumaMamma @ 3/25/2008 3:43:00 PM]]>225680«AvonResident:First of all - the group Avon Citizens for Change are organizing donations - not the family. This woman is ALONE! The school board...]]>2008-03-25T15:43:00+01:002008-03-25T15:43:00+01:00«AvonResident:First of all - the group Avon Citizens for Change are organizing donations - not the family. This woman is ALONE! The school board has targeted this woman because she has been ill and figured she wouldn't put up much of a fight. Well they are wrong! There are thousands of acre's in this community that are undeveloped - and some are ACTUALLY for sale and meet the school boards needs. Eminent domain was never meant for this - it was to make room for roads and highways to build the infrastructure of towns and cities. Yes the community was behind the other land owners - why do you think the board backed down? I'll answer it for you - COMMUNITY OUTRAGE.
You have no idea what you are talking about - this property was purchased by her grandparents 60+ years ago and farmed as a family business. Just because you have land that was inherited does not make you inherently wealthy.
PS - thank God you are not my neighbor!I am glad to be your neighbor! Thanks for joining and sorry if anything offended you. I wanted to get her story out there BIG TIME!!
Reminds me of one of my favorite quotes..
When the Nazis came for the communists, I remained silent; I was not a communist.
When they locked up the social democrats, I remained silent; I was not a social democrat.
When they came for the trade unionists, I did not speak out; I was not a trade unionist.
When they came for the Jews, I remained silent; I wasn't a Jew.
When they came for me, there was no one left to speak out
Pastor Martin Niemller
xoxox Donna]]><![CDATA[AvonResident @ 3/25/2008 3:26:31 PM]]>2256562008-03-25T15:26:31+01:002008-03-25T15:26:31+01:00 You have no idea what you are talking about - this property was purchased by her grandparents 60+ years ago and farmed as a family business. Just because you have land that was inherited does not make you inherently wealthy.
PS - thank God you are not my neighbor!]]><![CDATA[tragluk @ 3/25/2008 1:44:55 PM]]>225560«2manyusernames : I am assuming they didn't step in and contribute to others who have had the sale of their property forced upon them. 2008-03-25T13:44:55+01:002008-03-25T13:44:55+01:00«2manyusernames : I am assuming they didn't step in and contribute to others who have had the sale of their property forced upon them.
They don't mind when other people's property even those that aren't well off enough to own 25 acres and be able to hire attys and setup web sites, have their land purchased. This is a pretty good point actually. The school board tried to do this with another person earlier, and did she fight it? Did she contribute to That fund? Did the community pass any kind of law to prevent that type of action from happening in the future?
The previous landowners had to hire an attorney to fight it.
So when your neighbors house beings to smoke, you stand back and say "Doesn't affect me" but when the fire reaches your doorstop THEN you say the community should help? Had you just pitched in when your neighbors home was smoking the fire would have never reached your house.]]><![CDATA[TraumaMamma @ 3/25/2008 10:33:41 AM]]>225398«2manyusernames:Yes, you are right. My main point is eminent domain is a fact. It has been here for longer than the US has been a country or even...]]>2008-03-25T10:33:41+01:002008-03-25T10:33:41+01:00«2manyusernames:Yes, you are right. My main point is eminent domain is a fact. It has been here for longer than the US has been a country or even a colony for that matter.
There is very little to fight. What grounds will they use? Such things happen every single day. That is probably one reason why they are ignoring her "testimony".
Also I would like to know how much the government is offering for the land.750,000 and she doesn't want it.
Regarding donations?
Notify the teller that you are making a donation to Avon Citizens for Change and they will take care of you. We pledge to you that all donations will be used to assist Mary Jane Wolfe in our fight against the Avon school board. Any donations not used once we win this fight, will be donated in Mary Jane's name to an Avon school related organization such as the PTA or Booster's Club.]]><![CDATA[2manyusernames @ 3/25/2008 10:24:50 AM]]>225391«TraumaMamma : Sorry, but when the taxpayers money fund the attorneys who are going after the homeowner, I don't see anything wrong WHATSOEVER wi...]]>2008-03-25T10:24:50+01:002008-03-25T10:24:50+01:00«TraumaMamma : Sorry, but when the taxpayers money fund the attorneys who are going after the homeowner, I don't see anything wrong WHATSOEVER with people trying to contribute to her defense.
My God. The woman has throat cancer and wants to hand the land down to her family. You can bet if it was my farm on the line, I would be accepting any help or donations to help fight!
The city will cut their own throats if they do this. No levy will ever be passed, and people will not get voted back into office.
Look at the video. Council cannot even turn around and LOOK at this woman, who is pleading her case.Yes, you are right. My main point is eminent domain is a fact. It has been here for longer than the US has been a country or even a colony for that matter.
There is very little to fight. What grounds will they use? Such things happen every single day. That is probably one reason why they are ignoring her "testimony".
Also I would like to know how much the government is offering for the land.]]><![CDATA[TraumaMamma @ 3/25/2008 10:13:10 AM]]>225389«2manyusernames : Sorry, I lost any sympathy when the family is asking for donations to prevent the government from purchasing their p...]]>2008-03-25T10:13:10+01:002008-03-25T10:13:10+01:00«2manyusernames : Sorry, I lost any sympathy when the family is asking for donations to prevent the government from purchasing their property.
I am assuming they didn't step in and contribute to others who have had the sale of their property forced upon them.
They don't mind when other people's property even those that aren't well off enough to own 25 acres and be able to hire attys and setup web sites, have their land purchased.
Eminent Domain predates the constitution. We inherited it from English Common Law. There is very little room to fight.
What is wrong (and it isn't the case here) is when local governments use eminent domain to replace the property with something that will produce more tax revenue such as giving the land to a developer to build high-dollar homes.
GW Bush signed an order that prevents the federal government from doing such things. Sadly some states do allow that.Sorry, but when the taxpayers money fund the attorneys who are going after the homeowner, I don't see anything wrong WHATSOEVER with people trying to contribute to her defense.
My God. The woman has throat cancer and wants to hand the land down to her family. You can bet if it was my farm on the line, I would be accepting any help or donations to help fight!
The city will cut their own throats if they do this. No levy will ever be passed, and people will not get voted back into office.
Look at the video. Council cannot even turn around and LOOK at this woman, who is pleading her case.]]><![CDATA[2manyusernames @ 3/25/2008 9:59:49 AM]]>225384 I am assuming they didn't step in and contribute to others who have had the sale of their property forced upon them. ...]]>2008-03-25T09:59:49+01:002008-03-25T09:59:49+01:00 I am assuming they didn't step in and contribute to others who have had the sale of their property forced upon them.
They don't mind when other people's property even those that aren't well off enough to own 25 acres and be able to hire attys and setup web sites, have their land purchased.
Eminent Domain predates the constitution. We inherited it from English Common Law. There is very little room to fight.
What is wrong (and it isn't the case here) is when local governments use eminent domain to replace the property with something that will produce more tax revenue such as giving the land to a developer to build high-dollar homes.
GW Bush signed an order that prevents the federal government from doing such things. Sadly some states do allow that.]]><![CDATA[dollyllama @ 3/25/2008 9:47:22 AM]]>225368«TraumaMamma : Yes, but they don't want any other properties, even ones that ARE for sale!This is really tragic and unreasona...]]>2008-03-25T09:47:22+01:002008-03-25T09:47:22+01:00«TraumaMamma : Yes, but they don't want any other properties, even ones that ARE for sale!This is really tragic and unreasonable. I hope the family prevails.]]><![CDATA[TraumaMamma @ 3/25/2008 7:47:12 AM]]>225311«dollyllama : Isn't there any land that the school board can buy that won't be putting someone out?Yes, but they don't want a...]]>2008-03-25T07:47:12+01:002008-03-25T07:47:12+01:00«dollyllama : Isn't there any land that the school board can buy that won't be putting someone out?Yes, but they don't want any other properties, even ones that ARE for sale!]]><![CDATA[dollyllama @ 3/25/2008 7:38:08 AM]]>225304«TraumaMamma : That farm has been around since I was a kid....we used to go there to get our vegetables. My parents still go there. I picked my p...]]>2008-03-25T07:38:08+01:002008-03-25T07:38:08+01:00«TraumaMamma : That farm has been around since I was a kid....we used to go there to get our vegetables. My parents still go there. I picked my pumpkins out there every year and picked our own tomatoes.
*sigh*Isn't there any land that the school board can buy that won't be putting someone out?]]><![CDATA[TraumaMamma @ 3/25/2008 7:08:14 AM]]>225300 *sigh*]]>2008-03-25T07:08:14+01:002008-03-25T07:08:14+01:00 *sigh*]]>