There is no better picture for that one! LOL!

I was wondering how the hell Malaysia was coming up with a space program until:
cheap. That doesn't count.

Someday we will reach a point where this kind of news would get as much press as "first catholic" or "first person with a wart on his arm".

The fact that "First Muslim" shows a distinct attitude that Muslim people are somehow inferior and thus this is an achievement. I have the same issue whenever I see news about what are not really accomplishments but are news because it was the "first woman" or "first racial group". Those announcements BUILD barriers, they do not break them down.

Now the fact that Malaysia could participate in the space effort is news. A comparatively small economy that could not support an entire space program of their own now has a way. We see international cooperation, the achievement of an underdog (financially, in this case), and the expansion of the human experience in space. (Yeah, I know, it is more about "somebody is making money", but I am trying to be positive here.)

Same story, but I see the way this was presented was a pretty good indicator that we have a ways to go as a society.

Oh, please!

It was the muslims who are talking about it being the first muslim, they are more worried about if he will fast or not and how to pray facing mecca when you are in space.

So it is their culture that has a long way to go. About 14 centuries or so.

Yeah, it was funny, but I have to admit it was a bit rude so I changed it. Sorry.

I clearly understood that the claim had a Muslim source. Read it again. I didn't say it was non-muslims making the claim or that it was consciously derogatory. I also didn't say that a "first woman" story was always written by a man, or that a "first African-American" story was written by a white guy.

That the distinction was made indicates a feeling that the group in question is somehow inferior and finally accomplished something DESPITE the attribute in question. The statement gives a clue into the thoughts of the speaker. It is a self-revealing statement, not a conscious attempt to demean.

I am, and will always be, peeved at accomplishments stated like this. They are not overcoming a handicap that prevented the accomplishment.

And by "AS A SOCIETY" I did not mean US Society, or Western Society. I was speaking of mankind. in general. I thought that was obvious in the post.

I stand by my statement. This kind of story is presented as breaking barriers, but such distinctions BUILD barriers, they do not tear them down.

Well, actually they are. You compare women, African-Americans and Muslims. Their similarity is that all are marginalized groups, thus a "first" on their part is remarkable. A white male lawyer elected president is not history-making news; the first woman would be.

People are marginalized for a variety of reasons, but I do agree that this often carries the stigma of inferiority. And that is pretty much always wrong.

Boo-hoo, I am marginalized. It is not a handicap. But that is beside the point. Gets tiring after a while to keep hearing that <group XXX> are not expected to succeed so it is news when they do. Wouldn't it be better if we fixed that issue?

My original hope was that we can reach a point where a <group XXX> isn't Earth-shattering headline news. I think you are making my point for me.

Actually, I didn't think I was arguing against your points. I am guessing you do not belong to a marginalized group. Talk to a poor African-American some day to find out if being marginalized is a handicap.

No, they are not handicapped. "First quadruple amputee to climb Mt. Everest" is someone overcoming a handicap. A handicap is an individual case where something that limits your abilities. If being a woman or an ethnic group limits someones abilities, then maybe they are mentally handicapped (in that they let their mind give them limits).

Tell Mother Theresa, Margaret Thatcher, Marie Curie, my Mom, and my sisters that they are handicapped. (Stand back when you do, though.) These people never fell into the I'm a woman so I need help and concessions trap. They realized that their gender was immaterial to what they wanted to accomplish. Did they have different challenges? Yes. Did they run around shouting to the rooftops that they did things DESPITE being handicapped? No. They break barriers, they don't create them.

Being Black does not mean poor and oppressed any more than my being White means I am rich and given anything I want. (BTW: Being White also does not automatically mean I am a bigot and don't understand. But I guess I should let the fact that some people think it does impact my life and change my evil ways, right?)

I maintain my original premise: "The first <insert group here> to do <insert activity others have done>" stories CREATE the very barrier they claim to break.

I restate my original hope: Someday we will be smart enough not to think this way.

For the record: I do not think a Muslim in Malaysia is in a marginalized group.

Edit: Reworded so automatic "you"s so it didn't read as a personal attack, it isn't.

That was just a propaganda news by the Malaysian government to make the peoples there to believe their leader is so GREAT. Reason is the general election is around the corner.

Another interesting point is the "Sukhoi Fighter Jets" purchased are twice the price purchased by Vietnam government.