Good for him, ballsy move, I hope he wins.

"I was told because I can't put my personal beliefs aside and pray with troops I wouldn't make a good leader," Hall said"


And this coming from a "leader" who can't put his personal beliefs aside. The I-ron-y.

CNN calls this an update, when it really is just a rehash with no real new information. Do they plan on republishing this every two months?

(which was also an update)

Can we email CNN and call DUPE?

Yes, it is a dupe with no new info.

It was a bulls**t claim earlier and is still a bulls**t claim.

There are a lot of atheists in the military.

He may feel that he was passed over promotion because of his atheism but that doesn't make it so.




First of all, that sounds nice, but adding the part about his failure to be promoted does sound like he wants to do a follow up, not to ask for compensation, just to ask for the money that he should have gotten as part of his unearned promotions.

Second of all, religious freedom - even lack of religion is guaranteed so the suit is pointless.

And how many of them feel that they can't be open about it?

His CO flat-out TOLD him that it was because of his atheism

Yes, religious freedom is guaranteed. So whoever is responsible for his religious freedom being infringed needs to be punished somehow.

So lets say that someone does search before posting for keywords like "athiest" and "Army" and then 220 links come back and the first page is full of stories from 8 months to a year ago.

Is there a way to organize the search results?

or are we supposed to go through all the returns to make sure Doggylives doesn't have to see any repeats?

Is there a forum thread about this?

Dude, why single me out? Am I just an easier target than 2many and larknet who both brought up the fact it was a dupe before I even commented?

I never even mentioned it being a dupe so I'm not sure what your issue is here.

I posted the picture in reply to larknets comment, I've never seen this story before.

*edit* Upvoted the edit to try and keep the fookin peace around here.

I was the one who originally found this out as a dupe. I did a simple search for "atheist" and "soldier" and got a number of replies. The two pointed out were on the first page and in the title of the article.

Everybody dupes something at one time or another. Just let it roll, mate. It isn't personal.

I didn't take it personal. Larknet and 2Many posted the links that were useful. I just mentioned you because of the picture you posted which was sarcastic (and funny). It just stuck out.

Not making a personal thing at all.

Too bad. There is no right to feel open about speaking your religious views.


Really? You know that? Is that documented? Proven? No, it is alleged. That is why the whole article is filled with "he said" "he feels" etc.

Even his statement concerning the alleged comment about not being a good leader doesn't say he didn't get promoted because he was an atheist (a statement easily shown to be false if you can show other atheists who have gotten promoted).

It says that even though he is an atheist, he can't put aside his personal views for the views of his men. If praying with his troops helps them, then it shouldn't matter what he believes in or doesn't believe in. If praying to The Sacred Oak Tree of Britain makes his men feel better, improves their morale, allows them to fight another day, then put some antlers on your head and pray. Even if it is a meaningless ritual to you.

He wants tolerance? Perhaps he should show tolerance.

Fine, than prove via military court/hearing his rights were infringed upon and proper actions will be taken. A lawsuit to "guarantee his religious freedom" is silly. They are already guaranteed. He probably doesn't have enough proof to convince a military panel so he is making a civil lawsuit so that he can gain some civilian sympathy without having to show any proof.

His claims about death threats is so over the top as to be a joke.

Right every atheist, heck even .01% of atheists in the military are systematically being murdered by their fellow troops for not believing in a God. That is just plain silly. Maybe he has had threats because he is being such a jerk about his beliefs, trying to force them down others throats that he is pissing off his soldiers. Even then there is a good chance the alleged threats mean nothing and are just your typical blowing off steam.

It sounds like he is not only an atheist but trying to make it a huge issue, trying to force others to be like him. Ignoring their views (since he won't pray with the men below him) and being harassed by his fellow soldiers.

There is no law that can be passed, no punishment that can be given that will ensure someone won't be harassed. That is going to happen no matter what. Being an a*****e to the point where you are antagonizing your fellow soldiers is just going to make the harassment worse.


If he was the only atheist, if there were a huge number of fellow atheist with the same set of allegations then perhaps there would be some sort of merit, that simply isn't the case.

How are his allegations less credible than what your assumptions and preconceived ideas have lead you to believe it sounds like?
Why assume he's a militant atheist shoving it down the throats of everyone around him when it seems to be just the opposite?

Good questions and perhaps I am wrong. I will admit that there is a chance that is so and that I am making assumptions without all the evidence.

My thoughts that led me to believe that are based on his statements and normal behavior.

He says that he was told he couldn't be a good leader because he couldn't separate his beliefs from the needs of his men and pray with them.

Now that doesn't sound like he is trying to force his views on the others, but it showing that he feels his views are more important than the troop's, more important than his men, etc.

If he doesn't believe in a god, fine. No problem. However if praying to a god makes your men fight better, if it helps their morale than do it.

There is very little chance that he is being threatened with murder simply because he doesn't believe in a god. Now I can see him pissing off his fellow troops if he is making an issue of his atheism, of trying to make it the most important thing, etc.

If all he was doing was not believing in God, I don't think anyone would care, no more than if he believed or disbelieved anything else. It is when someone starts preaching, proselytizing, etc, that people are irritated.

Okay so supposedly some men have have spoken with the people suing. That doesn't prove anything. Even their claim that they feel pressure to embrace Christianity doesn't mean they are being discriminated against. Prove the discrimination and I'm all for punishment and restitution of monies lost.

I've heard Mikey Weinstein speak, and it was vitriolic. He did not come across too well...but anyways...

In the DoD, I've been to MANY briefings on the proper "behavior" when it comes to religion, and hear about it constantly.

Almost every time someone in the military claims that he was unfairly treated because of his race or religion or whatever, the reality is that they were treated badly because they were douchebags and no one liked them.

That statement might seem a little broad, but I bet anyone else in the military on this board agrees.

Actually that statement generally fits all careers, not just military.

It isn't just religion either.

When someone gets poor customer service it is more likely that they got poor customer service because they are at a place where the wait help makes $8/hour with tips or they were being obnoxious than because of any other reason.

Isn't that exactly what he's trying to do?

The "take it to a military panel" argument doesn't work if you believe that you won't get a fair hearing in the institution you're complaining about.