Sonic Weapons Deployed In Pittsburgh Posted: 2 months ago by pocksucket
Protesters at the G20 summit in Pittsburgh were confronted by police using sonic cannons.
Comments: 27 Score: [-] 675 [+].
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Posted: 2 months ago by bcgrote:
After decades of car alarms, the sound itself (what the camera could capture) wasn't too onerous. But the way the camera was behaving makes me wonder what the reverberations were like.
Intriguing, but many of the protests were not authorized gatherings. Sad that we have to have that, but many of the protests are being led by anarchists (I.e., terrorists....)
And I feel for the neighbors who may just be caught in the crossfire...
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Posted: 2 months ago by T1000:
Better than tear gas I think...
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Posted: 2 months ago by germz:
Whats all this then? It is feared the sounds emitted are loud enough to damage eardrums and even cause fatal aneurysms.
ouch...to disrupt a protest?
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Posted: 2 months ago by Subobisis:
What exactly are they protesting?
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Posted: 2 months ago by maven:
The problem is, this isn't the best way to protest. It's not the best way to get their message heard, as Subobisis points out. They're protesting...but we don't know what. Which means they're just being a disruptive nuisance, and SHOULD be dispersed. Yes, this is annoying as heck, but if it's effective, then that's better than tear gas or putting officers at risk.
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Posted: 2 months ago by BrownTrout:
« Subobisis:What exactly are they protesting? Most of them aren't protesting anything.
These summits have become something of a magnet for anarchists - most of whom, don't actually care about what is being discussed. They just like to create havoc and civil disruption.
As for the sonic weapons... I think they're a better alternative to tear gas. The sonic beams are quite focused.
As long as you are not in the area that the sound is concenetrated on, you are pretty safe. Disperse and your ears stop ringing - no lasting effect.
With tear gas, the afteraffects of the irritant can last for hours.
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Posted: 2 months ago by T1000:
« BrownTrout : With tear gas, the afteraffects of the irritant can last for hours. Not really. I recently did 60 pushups in a tear gas tent (it sucked, I almost threw up afterwards) but I was feeling OK after about 5 minutes, almost normal within 10 minutes, and after maybe 45 minutes or so, my eyes weren't red anymore.
It doesn't last very long once you leave, for maybe 5 minutes you really feel like ass, but soon you're all better!
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Posted: 2 months ago by PulsisX:
« Subobisis : What exactly are they protesting? A lot of people are suspicious of the G8 and the newly established G20 group. This suspicion is splintered into several sub groups. Anti "New World Order" people see this organization as a malevolent arm of the worlds super wealthy to control the masses of humanity by influencing world economic markets. You can see in the last year how tying together the markets caused a domino effect of economic problem. These are the types of things people are protesting. Most of it stems from a fear of a class warfare and the exclusionary & secretive nature of the organization.
For some reason people get suspicious when the wealthiest people on the planet converge and hold secret meetings.
« BrownTrout :
These summits have become something of a magnet for anarchists - most of whom, don't actually care about what is being discussed. They just like to create havoc and civil disruption. You had not struck me as the type to know a lot of anarchists that you could speak for their motivations.
There are legitimate reasons for people to be concerned about this group and these meetings. To reduce the protesters as a bunch of trouble makers or terrorists(??wtf, really?) turns a blind eye on genuine concerns.
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Posted: 2 months ago by maven:
When they come to the table like a RATIONAL group of people with LEGITIMATE concerns identified, they will be treated that way.
Until then, they will be treated the way they behave.
That's what I meant about not being effective. When the protest does not have a clear goal, a clear reason, when it becomes nothing more than a riot in the streets, they are not accomplishing whatever goal they may have.
Picture this. You're sitting down for dinner, and there's a knock at your door. You answer the door. A man is standing there, holding a sign that says "Your garden sucks. Roses are crappy and should be replaced with petunias." You know what he wants, you don't have to agree or respond, but at least you know.
NOW picture opening the door to find someone screaming profanities and pulling your roses--that you've worked over, slaved over, done everything to make them happy--out of the ground and dancing on them.
Do you ask him why? No, you don't care. He's not behaving like he has a legitimate concern, he's acting like a lunatic, and getting him away from you and your house is most likely going to be your MINIMUM reaction.
When will people learn that how the message is delivered is very, very important?
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Posted: 2 months ago by BrownTrout:
« T1000 : Not really. I recently did 60 pushups in a tear gas tent (it sucked, I almost threw up afterwards) but I was feeling OK after about 5 minutes, almost normal within 10 minutes, and after maybe 45 minutes or so, my eyes weren't red anymore.
It doesn't last very long once you leave, for maybe 5 minutes you really feel like ass, but soon you're all better! I wasn't thinking so much about military people experiencing tear gas under controlled conditions as much as unknowing civilians who get hit with the stuff and don't immediately ventilate or flush their eyes with water (but run around in circles rubbing it into their eyes).
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Posted: 2 months ago by BrownTrout:
« PulsisX:
You had not struck me as the type to know a lot of anarchists that you could speak for their motivations.
There are legitimate reasons for people to be concerned about this group and these meetings. To reduce the protesters as a bunch of trouble makers or terrorists(??wtf, really?) turns a blind eye on genuine concerns. That's not what I said... I was pointing out the fact that many of the people who attend these protests are anarchists (mixed in with legitimate protestors).
By definition, an anarchist doesn't stand for anything but "anarchy" - that isn't what the true protestors are there for.
So mix a bunch of car burning assholes in with people who have legitimate concerns and the media focuses in on just the assholes.
Where I erred was in saying that "most" of them are anarchists. It really doesn't take that many to turn a civil protest into chaos.
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Posted: 2 months ago by T1000:
« BrownTrout:I wasn't thinking so much about military people experiencing tear gas under controlled conditions as much as unknowing civilians who get hit with the stuff and don't immediately ventilate or flush their eyes with water (but run around in circles rubbing it into their eyes). I didn't flush my eyes with water. You calling me a wimp? HUH?! :)
This wasn't my first rodeo with tear gas. I've been in it several times. Some in a tent, and some straight popped fresh from a can a few feet away. Every time, you feel fine after about 10 minutes. I promise. And this isn't just, me but the hundreds of other people I've seen exposed to it.
This last time I inhaled about as much tear gas as you can possibly inhale, or be exposed to. I didn't hold my breath or close my eyes through all 60 pushups, believe me. Most people hold their breath in it, and run away. I did more pushups in the stuff than most people can do at all, and I was fine.
Don't believe it's as bad as people make out. It sucks, and is definitely unpleasant, but it doesn't feel like you're getting burned alive or is just outrageously tortuous.
The best way I can describe it is like eating something really really spicy, but having that feeling on any sweaty area, and in your lungs (if you breath in).
I can understand that people with weak constitutions might say, "Oh God it was the worst thing ever blah blah poor me I'm getting killed by the government oh no woe is me I almost died"; but that's because they're wimps. :)
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Posted: 2 months ago by elsuper:
I happened to be browsing some conspiracy theory sites, because I get a kick out of that, and I came across something about the G20 protests.
There is a widespread perception in the tinfoil hat community that the G20 and various other supranational organizations are the precursor to a totalitarian One World Government, in which the Global Financial Elite rules the planet with an iron fist while the common folk work essentially as slaves (Before there are any wisecracks about "we already have that," they mean worse than now).
That is probably what their message was, and if you asked them why that was unclear, they would probably say it is because the Powers That Be use their control of the media to suppress all dissenting viewpoints in order to enact their Plan For a New World Order.
This stuff is so fascinating.
Edit: Sound cannons are really cool.
Score: [-] 123 [+].
Posted: 2 months ago by PulsisX:
« maven : When they come to the table like a RATIONAL group of people with LEGITIMATE concerns identified, they will be treated that way.
Until then, they will be treated the way they behave.
What if you are not allowed to the table. What if instead you are told to stand in a chain link pen they(in this case they = security, police, meeting organizers) call a "Freedom Zone"(you can interpret this particular item with as much irony as you see fit). One might imagine it would be difficult for the people at the table to hear their concerns, even when shouted, from a half mile down the street. At which point people will act out in order to get the attention. At which point they the media will of course pick the ravingest of lunatics as the voice of the protesters, which will justify their exclusion.
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I really enjoyed your garden allegory. I may steal it at some point.
« BrownTrout:That's not what I said... I was pointing out the fact that many of the people who attend these protests are anarchists (mixed in with legitimate protestors).
By definition, an anarchist doesn't stand for anything but "anarchy" - that isn't what the true protestors are there for.
Actually an Anarchist is someone that believes they don't need anybody to tell them what to do.(ie No government) An anarchist would tell you that laws are pointless because "good" people don't need them and "bad" people won't pay attention to them. Someone that doesn't believe in anything is a Nihilist. For more on Nihilism I will refer you to The Big Lubowski or for a drier explanation, Wikipedia.
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and more on the topic of the actual post... I think when the citizens of any nation become the targets of their own nations military it is not a good thing. The United States compels it's citizens with a duty to uphold liberty. When the public is excluded, when the decisions on the courses of nations are in the hands of banks, liberty is being buried. I will simply point to the near collapse of our economy and the great damage done around the world by these exact same human beings. Why worry, right?
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Posted: 2 months ago by jago:
Jon Pertwee and sonic weaponry: cool icon refrence, pocksucket. ;)
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Posted: 2 months ago by tgkprog:
thinks about the girl i once knew who could scream real loud. she was fun
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Posted: 2 months ago by fugazi:
« bcgrote :
Intriguing, but many of the protests were not authorized gatherings. Sad that we have to have that, but many of the protests are being led by anarchists (I.e., terrorists....)
not to mention Agents Provacateurs, whose roles have been well-documented.
And the conflation of "anarchists" with "terrorists" is not only a hyperbole, but a bit dramatic.
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Posted: 2 months ago by fugazi:
« maven : When they come to the table like a RATIONAL group of people with LEGITIMATE concerns identified, they will be treated that way.
Until then, they will be treated the way they behave.
Really? and just where would they find this table?
And how many "legitimate" media outlets have given any of these protestors a "legitimate" outlet through which they could articulate their concerns?
And where is American Family Radio (spit) to decry this infringement against freedom of assembly/speech?
If you are all for treating people the way they behave, then entire cities' worth of agents, bureaucrats, govt officials, bankers, and executives should be secretly "disappeared" and buried in mass graves.
But since they have 'legitimate' power they can abuse others. while the abused should not be allowed to speak up...do i understand correctly?
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Posted: 2 months ago by maven:
In this country? Seriously? You don't think the average person can get news out there without behaving irrationally?
I live on an Air Force base. About once a MONTH, there are protesters lined up at the gate. They have to file for a permit, but all the permits are approved as long as they are filed in time (I believe the timeline was one week prior to the protest). The Air Force then puts up barriers to keep the protesters off the roads, so they aren't a traffic menace, and provides port-a-potties for the protesters to use.
In other words, the US military spends it's time and money to make sure the people PROTESTING AGAINST THE US MILITARY can do so safely.
b***h about the need to fill out a form if you want, but don't tell me there's not a legitimate outlet available for someone who is interested in taking that route.
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Posted: 2 months ago by iceburg:
If I could, I would up-vote once for the theme pic and again for the article.
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