The concept of existing for infinity is a concept that humans can't fully understand. It is difficulty to think of anything that never had a beginning such as the Christian God. So comparing it to describing site to a blind man would not have any thing to do that you are better then they are or Christian or not because every one would be considered blind, even Christians.

I hope that that clarifies that statement to some extent. I would like to describe why I think some of those reasons wrong but have to finish a paper (or start one for that matter)

EDIT I am too slow...

Just because we don't know what caused the Big Bang yet, doesn't mean that I have to have faith in the fact that it happened. Cosmic microwave background radiation pretty much shows that that's what happened.

As for Evolution, that has so much evidence behind it that you would have to be actively staying "blind" to it to not believe it by now. I would be willing to bet money that you probably haven't read any books on the subject or even read the Wikipedia article on the matter.

Now, you might go on to say, "Yes, I've read everything there is to know about it, etc. and I just don't understand how it could have happened without a creator." The problem with this argument is that just because you can't figure something out doesn't mean that "God" did it. The complexity of life need not be explained by some omnipresent creator. It can be explained in a much simpler, Occam's razor abiding, way.

Ah, but that raises another hypothetical. If "God" can exist for infinity, then why can't the universe itself; without the need for a creator?

Now, that's fairly easy to answer using physics, but you obviously aren't basing your argument in the realm of science, so why should I have to?

Correct me if i am wrong but doesn't the big bang theory believe in a start of the universe? and all the universe is continually expanding from the center of it, were the "big bang" started? and before this point there is no idea of what happened? I will confess that i am no expert on big bang theory so i may be mistaken.

not sure why i talked about that but could elaborate on the physics aspect?

Don't you ever genuinely wonder "why"?

If we truly exist by some random, extraordinary instance. What's the point? And if there is no point, why do many of us, religious or not, seek such an answer?

And just to throw this out there, why does God always have to be perceived as some sort of being? "God" is a word, what that term represents is what's truly important.

The asking Jesus to appear this is actually a good Idea If you are genuinely seeking God, with the beleif that he might exist and if he does you would actually want to meet/perceive his reality I believe this is a request that will always be granted.

Oh man, buddha, you were asking for it with this one. It's a very interesting site, though. I'm not gonna state my beliefs 'cause I don't want to ruffle any more feathers than those already ruffled, but it's informative to read this side of the argument. Even if you don't agree with one side of a debate, it's always good to at least understand where both sides are coming from.

I don't know if you go to Fark but this guy pays $50 something like twice a month for this to be linked in the Fark classifieds.

Grrrr. I am truly getting tired of these debates. I am a Christian and I believe God made everything. I also believe that the Plime community is not benefiting from these debates. Inevitably they turn into what reads as antagonistic jabs between Mersh and whoever is willing to engage him, once again, in the debate. Mersh, you are a high school aged person if I remember right. I am an older fart (37) and have some advice for you. Believe what you want, or if you like it better this way, know what you know. But you need to do a couple of other things. 1. You are way too intense, chill out. 2. Learn humility. You may be smart, but there is much that you don't know. To the community at large I say, people will seek you out if they want you to share your knowledge, experience, and beliefs with them. I have learned that someone without questions does not want your answers, no matter how good you think they are. So, do I contradict myself by saying that and posting this? Probably.

Hahaha, you said "fart."
(That's probably the most involved I'll get in a religious debate online)

I agree, historically I have not gotten into these either. I guess I'm feelin' a bit saucy tonight.

edit to add:Now that I said saucy I thought that I would switch back to my "Suave" avatar. I wonder if it will change with this edit.

edit to add to the added edit: Nope, didn't change. I guess you all will just have to look at my profile to see me in my suaveness. Just make sure your sitting down, cause I'm a real looker!

Btw, I just realized this was posted by Buddha. That made me laugh.

I wish everything in this world could be explained by logic, science and reasoning...then this silly science vs. religion debate could finally be over.

But since not everything can be explained through logic, science and reasoning...the debate continues.

Faith is the opposite of Thinking.

Thinking all the time is tiring.

When you're tired of thinking do you just suppose to yourself that inexplicable things must be the result of magic? Is it comforting to imagine a great paternal entity is somehow influencing your everyday life, however improbable it may seem? Thinking is extremely important. Belief without rational thought is dangerous.

I am tired of people respecting Religion and Faith as if they deserve special protection from criticism. People that smoke are discriminated against (i.e. Losing Jobs) so why not discriminate against the Religious? Nobody is born with a certain belief so why is it protected by laws the same way Race and Sexual Orientation are? If the Morbidly Obese can be charged extra to ride an airplane then why can't we disallow those who declare Holy War from riding the same Airplane?

I have these debates because I know that I don't know everything. You never know when someone on the opposite side is going to rattle off something that I haven't thought of before.

If you don't like these debates it's as simple as not clicking on the button that brought you here. I happen to like them and I don't care what kind of person you think that makes me.

I am sorry that you have become that cynical already. I am not trying to be sarcastic at all, but it kind of makes me sad that at your age you think you have gained so much knowledge that every now and again someone might "rattle off something" that you don't already know. I have been a Christian longer than you have been anything. And I have not always been a Christian, so I have also been not a Christian for longer than you have been anything. Do you understand my meaning? Books teach you much, I have many. I sincerely doubt you have read half as much as I have. But living teaches more, and I've had twice as much experience as you, and from both side of the fence. I am not trying to anger you or anything like that. I am trying to show you that there is a better way (and I am not referring to faith, but I'm not excluding that either) to live than what you are doing. You seem to have much to offer, but you have much more to learn. While you are involved in these debates try to be more of a student than a teacher. Listen and learn, share your ideas...gently. Let others teach you, bright one. Listen to their words and their hearts with out forming your response as they speak. Who knows, you just may discover something admirable and beautiful about them or their beliefs, even though you still do not share them. I hope this reads with the tone I mean and I intend no sarcasm at all. Only a genuine interest in sharing a little of my perspective with you.

I actually like this guy that wrote this article.. He does bring up some valid points and did his resaerch quoting things directly from the bible and interpreted them in his way, which is what you're supposed to do with the bible right? I ecspecially like section 13 about slavery.. Actually made me go back and read the bible for the first time in a while just to verify it and damn.. there was actually a price set on slaves according to the bible. Feel free to believe and have faith in anything you want, However I choose to question things. I want our world and our civilization to advance and I really just see religion as contributing to slowing down progress and dividing us. To me it seems like the bible was basically a group of people that sat down back in the day and collected ideas about how they thought people should live, a way to scare people into behaving humanely. Times were different back then and maybe that was needed, but I think if we are to move together as a people and actually explore and expand civilization then we need to just get rid of religion not just christianity.

I am incredibly tired of people telling me that I can't possibly know as much as them just because I happen to be younger than them. I'm tired of people taking my arguments as naive little meanderings of my precious young mind just because I'm younger than them. My age has nothing to do with my intelligence or wisdom. I'm not saying that I'm smarter or wiser than any of you. But my youth doesn't make me the opposite either.

Also; you took my "rattle off" statement in the completely opposite direction of how I meant it.